If ‘messianic jews’ are really jewish…?


Why are they completely and utterly silent on questions that attack jews or deny the holocaust?

they show up with enormous numbers of thumbs down whenever jewish theology is questioned, but i have yet to see a single one of them step in to defend the jewish religion or its people against hateful assaults from…

Yes, bad tim (appropriate avatar name, by the way), those of us who say we are Jews, are Jews. Why else would we want to align ourselves with one of the most hated groups of people in the entire world? We wouldn’t! We are what we are! And whether or not we are Rabbinical Jews, we are still Jews. Me? I’m Karaite Jew, as was the Jewish Messiah. And you BET I fight against those who deny the holocaust! I lost several immediate family members in the camps and I find it repulsive that some of American schools (some right in my own city, in fact!!) teach that the holocaust never happened. Revisionist history is HIDEOUS and Americans need to rise up against it!

That being said, I get literally sick to my stomach seeing the tripe that Yahoo “jews” spew about us Messianic Jews on these boards! It’s as if they have nothing better to do than snipe at people who are in the same boat as they are (so to speak)! It’s beyond vicious, it’s INSANE! And you might not be a Jew, but you battle along side of your insane friends, attacking us because of our faith. What could be worse?!

May God bless you richly and open your eyes to the wide path you’re stumbling down.

D1

A messianic Jew is a Jew that believes that Jesus is the Messiah. Christians and Messianic Jews believe that Jesus is the Messiah. They are Jews. The point of view of the anti Messianice Jews is best summed up by Mark JPAS when he said “it is acceptable to blend some degree of foreign spiritual elements with Judaism. The one exception is Christianity, which is perceived to be incompatible with any form of Jewishness. This is the double standard that is applied to Christianity even though Jesus is considered the Jewish Messiah in Christianity. Messianic Jews are looked at with even greater disdain. Why? its a cover for there own deviations from Judaism. Some Jews need to maintain a connection to Jewish family because they have deviated so much from traditional Judaism that many Orthodox question their Jewishness. They need find some way to distract attention because of there deviation from the Torah. This is done by pointing their finger at others to direct attention away from their own actions. You can’t give yourself a title and expect that it makes you something. This is the argument that has been used against Jews that decide that Jesus is the Messiah. We are told that the mere belief of a different nature of God immediately invalidated a Jews Jewishness. At the same time Jews that become atheists, pantheists or stop practicing any element of their religion we are told are still Jews. They say that you can believe in anything but Jesus. Jews call conversion “joining the tribe”. Things that would never fly in Orthodox or for that matter Messianic Judaism can be found in the Reform and Reconstructionist movements. A good example of this is a previous question asked here. The person asking worshiped the God Ferris but did not believe in him or the Jewish God. The focus of the question was” …would you PERSONALLY feel comfortable welcoming me not just as a fellow congregant at your Synagogue, but as a member of the Tribe?” (so he was clearly asking about converting to Judaism). The response was “Reform Judaism covers a wide swath of beliefs and practices and I am sure you will be wholly accepted. … I personally would accept you whole heartily as a fellow Jew.” So some Jews will accept all kinds of deviations from the Torah but not belief in “Jesus”. Let’s not forget the Reform movement wanted to change the sabbath to Sunday to be more like Christianity. Most Messianic Jews are Torah observant yet you can become an atheist, stop practicing their faith, become a Buddhist, join a Unitarian Church and still be a Jew in the eyes of Reform/Reconstructionist Jews. Most Orthodox when asked about other Jews will say they don’t know what non Orthodox Jews are. The same applies to the other sects. Speaking of sects Jews will tell you there are no sects but its not true. Rabbinical Jews follow an understanding of their faith that was established 1,900 years ago. They have their own canon of Scripture. There are also non Rabbinical Jews such as the Ethiopian Jews that follows the pattern of the Christian Old Testament and they have many additional books that they consider to be scripture. A group called the Karaites is the opposite of the Ethiopian and only believe in the 5 Books of Moses. Rabbinical Jews call Karaites “a sect of Judaism”. You can goggle it and see for yourself. Don’t let anyone tell you that there are no sects in Judaism. They say the the teachings of Jesus are very different from Judaism. They also claim that Jesus taught nothing new from the rabbis before him. Then they we tell you that there were no rabbis until a hundred years after the time of Jesus. Its all about winning the argument to them not about what’s true. The problem is not differences but similarities. You should know ALL the writers of the Christian Bible were Jews but one. Much of our Scriptures are shared. The vast majority of early believers in Jesus were Jews. So when you hear the exact opposite you need to keep that in mind. A Jew can believe in Jesus and still be a Jew. Edit: those that make personal accusations should include links or shut up.

Because they’re Jews by birth.

Perhaps it’s because they get so fed up and sick of being run into the ground and denigrated by people from the other branches of Judaism that they just quit trying. But that is assuming that the basic premise of your question is even valid, and I doubt that it is.

Christian fundamentalists are very unlikely to make any kind of a “hateful assault” (as you put it) on Judaism. Furthermore, Messianic Jews are just as quick to disagree those who deny the holocaust as most other rational people, but may be asking themselves, “why waste my time arguing with idiots”. Why indeed?

As far as questioning whether or not Messianic Jews are “really Jewish” (which seems to be the real reason you asked this question), I’ll only mention two points: 1. not everybody who attends a Messianic Synagogue is a Jew—there are many Messianic gentlies as well, and they are not considered Jews unless they join the house of Israel through a formal conversion, including brit and mikveh. 2. Not every Jew who believes in Jesus is a Messianic Jew—many worship with Christians in churches.

You said….
“yet to see a single one of them step in to defend the jewish religion or its people against hateful assaults from muslim and christian fundies.”

So tell me my friend, when have you seen Christians assaulting Jews?

As a Messianic Jew, I have not been silent on antisemitism or on those who deny the Holocaust! Whilst I may differ from my non-Messianic Jewish brethren theologically I respect and support their right to believe how and what they believe. I am an ardent supporter of Israel and Zionism. I continually speak out against islamo-fascist and ‘palestine’. I lost many members of my family in the Holocaust, my grandfather was in Auschwitz. Don’t presume I am silent or don’t care. When anti-semites have tossed pennies at me and burned a cross in my yard, it didn’t matter to them if I was Messianic, Orthodox or Reform; all they saw was a Jew.

I have been asking the same question about a certain “interfaith group” here on Yahoo.that seems to love to go on the offensive against Messianics and Christians. I rarely see them defending Israel or going against the Holocaust deniers except for a few individuals.

I have answered a few questions about it with out hearing a peep from them. I’ve even tried emailing them about a few questions and I was ignored.

It would seem that Jews believing in Yeshua are a greater threat to them. One person said any Jew believing that Jesus is the Messiah is a treat to Jews everywhere. So with this kind of oppression they are to tied down defending themselves to join in the fight in any numbers.

One thing for sure they would rather be standing up for Israel and going up against the Holocaust deniers the trying to argue for their own right to exist.

Psalm 95

I had no idea that your considered Jewish if you defend Jews over the internet?! I had no idea that people were making “hateful assaults” to Jews either.

I did know that all types of people are retaliating against a group of “Jew” (no one really knows if they are real Jews or not they just practices a type of Judaism) who lie, fight, use hateful assaults against people, attack other Jews or anyone who disagrees with them.

Perhaps you should take a second

This question is shocking & shows a certain mental instability.

Messianic Jews do care & you are fighting against a section of Jews
who care more than most about the Holocaust & Jewish attacks.
U are fighting your own brothers & sisters.
Lev 19:16-18 from the Stone Edition Tanach:)
” You shall not be a gossipmonger among your people, you shall not
stand aside while your fellow’s blood is shed- I am Hashem.
You shall NOT Hate your brother in your heart; you shall reprove your
fellow & not bear sin because of him. YOU shall NOT take revenge &
you shall NOT bear a grudge against the members of your people;
YOU shall love your fellow as yourself- I am Hashem.”

As usual, some Jews who answer this sort of question have no idea what they are talking about when it comes to the history of the Church of G_d.

Acts 2:1-11 ESV When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place. (2) And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. (3) And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. (4) And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.**** (5) Now there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation under heaven. ****** (6) And at this sound the multitude came together, and they were bewildered, because each one was hearing them speak in his own language. (7) And they were amazed and astonished, saying, “Are not all these who are speaking Galileans? (8) And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language? (9) Parthians and Medes and Elamites and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, (10) Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya belonging to Cyrene, and visitors from Rome, (11) both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians–we hear them telling in our own tongues the mighty works of God.”….41 So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.

That’s 3,000 people who were in Jerusalem for the Feast of Pentecost, Jews, Benjamanites, and Levites.
Three Thousand. One day. Converted.

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